New to this forum – some specific questions regarding testing & diagnosis

Home The Candida Forum Candida Questions New to this forum – some specific questions regarding testing & diagnosis

This topic contains 42 replies, has 5 voices, and was last updated by  ReneeVV 6 years, 6 months ago.

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  • #89056

    ReneeVV
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    I’ve been on a journey of ill health for more than seven years now. I’ve “learned” a lot of things from both mainstream and alternative health sources, have tried innumerable protocols, supplements, and spent untold thousands (more like tens of thousands) of dollars but am still suffering and searching. So, my questions are very pointed and not general.

    I’ve had 1 Doctors Data Comprehensive Stool Analysis / Parasitology x3, 1 Doctors Data Comprehensive Stool Analysis (w/ no parasitology), and 1 Metametrix Gastrointestinal Function Profile. NONE of them were terribly remarkable, what little any of them did show was bacterial, and NONE of them showed any yeast at all. Some “people/groups” say to use these tests to find out if you have a yeast problem, whereas other “people/groups” say that stool tests are inconclusive because you can have yeast show up, but it’s not causing a problem, or you can have yeast NOT show up when it IS causing a problem. I saw one person on this forum say that a Candida Immune Complexes blood test is 99% accurate, but didn’t say where you get such a test and if you can order it for yourself. I spent hours reading info on health-truth.com about the Biamonte Method (which others have commented on as being extremely expensive, etc., etc.) and was interested in some specialized urine test kit he talks about as supposedly accurately showing whether you have a yeast problem or not and how bad it is or how much progress you are making at eradicating it, but of course you can only get the kit through him if you sign up for the whole protocol and phone consults, etc. I’m through trying to get/find a doctor or naturopath to order tests – I can’t keep running around to different people and can’t afford to do it. I want to order tests myself, find out what’s going on, and then treat myself if at all possible.) So, keeping all of the above in mind: Do I have a yeast problem or not? Can I get a test that will definitively tell me if I have a yeast problem? The only test I’ve found that I could get myself is Genova’s Candida Intensive Culture that one can order directly through Directlabs.com. Is that a good test or just another test that may be a false positive or negative?

    #89059

    dvjorge
    Participant
    Topics: 283
    Replies: 1368

    ReneeVV wrote: I’ve been on a journey of ill health for more than seven years now. I’ve “learned” a lot of things from both mainstream and alternative health sources, have tried innumerable protocols, supplements, and spent untold thousands (more like tens of thousands) of dollars but am still suffering and searching. So, my questions are very pointed and not general.

    I’ve had 1 Doctors Data Comprehensive Stool Analysis / Parasitology x3, 1 Doctors Data Comprehensive Stool Analysis (w/ no parasitology), and 1 Metametrix Gastrointestinal Function Profile. NONE of them were terribly remarkable, what little any of them did show was bacterial, and NONE of them showed any yeast at all. Some “people/groups” say to use these tests to find out if you have a yeast problem, whereas other “people/groups” say that stool tests are inconclusive because you can have yeast show up, but it’s not causing a problem, or you can have yeast NOT show up when it IS causing a problem. I saw one person on this forum say that a Candida Immune Complexes blood test is 99% accurate, but didn’t say where you get such a test and if you can order it for yourself. I spent hours reading info on health-truth.com about the Biamonte Method (which others have commented on as being extremely expensive, etc., etc.) and was interested in some specialized urine test kit he talks about as supposedly accurately showing whether you have a yeast problem or not and how bad it is or how much progress you are making at eradicating it, but of course you can only get the kit through him if you sign up for the whole protocol and phone consults, etc. I’m through trying to get/find a doctor or naturopath to order tests – I can’t keep running around to different people and can’t afford to do it. I want to order tests myself, find out what’s going on, and then treat myself if at all possible.) So, keeping all of the above in mind: Do I have a yeast problem or not? Can I get a test that will definitively tell me if I have a yeast problem? The only test I’ve found that I could get myself is Genova’s Candida Intensive Culture that one can order directly through Directlabs.com. Is that a good test or just another test that may be a false positive or negative?

    Candida Immune Complexes in blood from Genova Lab. You can order it online. I am not sure who is going to extract the blood and how to send it to the lab. They probably give you special instructions.
    This is the test you need. If this test is negative, you don’t have an intestinal fungal overgrowth. I can send you references of Yeast Metabolites in urine that may help, but why spend more money when you can get the Immune Complexes ??

    http://www.greatplainslaboratory.com/home/eng/oat_yeast_combo.asp

    https://www.integrativepsychiatry.net/genova_diagnostics_candida_immune_complexes_and_antibodies.html

    Jorge.

    #89060

    ReneeVV
    Participant
    Topics: 1
    Replies: 21

    Hi, thanks for the reply.

    After I posted, I hunted around some more and found both the test and a place that will allow you to order it through their website (you can’t order directly from Genova as a patient):
    https://www.integrativepsychiatry.net/genova_diagnostics_candida_immune_complexes_and_antibodies.html

    I would be interested in information on the yeast metabolites in urine too though, even if I don’t spend more money to get tested, so yes, please give me any info you have on that.

    Follow-up questions: If I get this test AND I test positively, how do I interpret the results since it is just a number, other than just saying, yeah, it’s positive? Does a number that is positive but is less than some number mean not much of an issue, and a number that is positive but is some number or higher mean that you are really having a serious issue? Also, how do I know WHICH anti-fungal agents will be effective or the most effective for MY particular yeast issue?

    #89061

    dvjorge
    Participant
    Topics: 283
    Replies: 1368

    ReneeVV wrote: Hi, thanks for the reply.

    After I posted, I hunted around some more and found both the test and a place that will allow you to order it through their website (you can’t order directly from Genova as a patient):
    https://www.integrativepsychiatry.net/genova_diagnostics_candida_immune_complexes_and_antibodies.html

    I would be interested in information on the yeast metabolites in urine too though, even if I don’t spend more money to get tested, so yes, please give me any info you have on that.

    Follow-up questions: If I get this test AND I test positively, how do I interpret the results since it is just a number, other than just saying, yeah, it’s positive? Does a number that is positive but is less than some number mean not much of an issue, and a number that is positive but is some number or higher mean that you are really having a serious issue? Also, how do I know WHICH anti-fungal agents will be effective or the most effective for MY particular yeast issue?

    I gave you two links. Sorry, I pasted them after writing my post.
    The severity of the infection is hard to determine in a test. The immune complexes is very interesting because if those candida cell wall fragments of complement are circulating in your blood, it means there is transition from a unicell form to a filamentous form. I mean there is evidence of candida mutation to a virulent form in your gut.
    To determine the susceptibility to antifungal drugs, you need a stool culture able to detect what candida specie or strain is affecting you. Many times, the stool cultures are negative, however, people are experiencing a severe fungal growth.
    But, sometimes, you are lucky to get a positive culture.

    Jorge.

    #89062

    raster
    Participant
    Topics: 104
    Replies: 6838

    You need to have the results analyzed by a naturopathic doctor…

    #89063

    ReneeVV
    Participant
    Topics: 1
    Replies: 21

    dvjorge wrote:

    Hi, thanks for the reply.

    I gave you two links. Sorry, I pasted them after writing my post.
    The severity of the infection is hard to determine in a test. The immune complexes is very interesting because if those candida cell wall fragments of complement are circulating in your blood, it means there is transition from a unicell form to a filamentous form. I mean there is evidence of candida mutation to a virulent form in your gut.
    To determine the susceptibility to antifungal drugs, you need a stool culture able to detect what candida specie or strain is affecting you. Many times, the stool cultures are negative, however, people are experiencing a severe fungal growth.
    But, sometimes, you are lucky to get a positive culture.

    Jorge.

    Thanks again. I see that one of the two posts you included was the same one I found through which I can order the test.

    #89064

    dvjorge
    Participant
    Topics: 283
    Replies: 1368

    Yes, there are several online places to order it. Look for price.

    Jorge.

    #89065

    ReneeVV
    Participant
    Topics: 1
    Replies: 21

    dvjorge wrote: Candida Immune Complexes in blood from Genova Lab. You can order it online. I am not sure who is going to extract the blood and how to send it to the lab. They probably give you special instructions.
    This is the test you need. If this test is negative, you don’t have an intestinal fungal overgrowth. I can send you references of Yeast Metabolites in urine that may help, but why spend more money when you can get the Immune Complexes ??

    http://www.greatplainslaboratory.com/home/eng/oat_yeast_combo.asp

    https://www.integrativepsychiatry.net/genova_diagnostics_candida_immune_complexes_and_antibodies.html

    Jorge.

    You know, I actually had a test similar to the OAT (but without the yeast culture). It was the Genova Metabolic Analysis Profile. The only thing that showed up really high on it was the Malabsorption Marker DHPPA. Lactic Acid was a little low. Genova rated my Amino Acid Metabolism Relative Probability of Disorder as 5 on a scale of 0 to 10. My Bacterial Dysbiosis Relative Probability of Disorder was 7 on a scale of 0 to 10. All of the other Relative Probability of Disorders and Relative Need For were 0. I guess they based the Dysbiosis on the DHPPA, but I’ve read elsewhere that that is indicative of an abundance of BENEFICIAL bacteria, not harmful bacteria, and I guess it doesn’t relate to Candida at all. In fact the Yeast/Fungal Dysbiosis Markers of Arabinose, Tartaric Acid, and Citramalic Acid were all low or relatively low. So what does that tell me?

    Renee

    #89067

    dvjorge
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    Topics: 283
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    I need to see the CDSA results to give you my opinion. How were the level of beneficial flora ?? E. Coli ?? L. Acidophillus ?? Bifidobacterium ??

    Jorge.

    #89070

    ReneeVV
    Participant
    Topics: 1
    Replies: 21

    My 2005 CSA:

    Beneficial flora
    Bifidobacter 2+
    E. Coli 1+
    Lactobacillus 2+

    Imbalances
    Bacillus 1+
    Gamma strep 1+
    Klebsiella pneumoniae 1+

    No Dysbiotic flora

    My 2009 CSA:

    Beneficial flora
    Bifidobacterium 0+
    E. Coli 1+
    Lactobacillus 1+
    Enterococcus 3+

    Imbalances
    Bacillus 2+
    Gamma strep 3+
    Alpha Haemolytic strep 1+

    No Dysbiotic flora

    The Metametrix GI Function Profile test results are harder to list. Are you familiar with that test?

    Renee

    #89073

    dvjorge
    Participant
    Topics: 283
    Replies: 1368

    Listed Beneficial Flora is low.
    E.Coli should be 3+
    L.Acidophillus should be 3+
    Bifidobactirium should be 4+

    I noticed a difference in Bifidobacterium from 2005 and your latest test.
    Did you take antibiotics ???

    Jorge.

    #89075

    ReneeVV
    Participant
    Topics: 1
    Replies: 21

    Yes, I had antibiotics a few times. A couple times it was because I had the SIBO breath test (borderline positive initially), went on Rifaximin (twice), had a follow-up SIBO breath test which was more positive than the first time! That was through a gastroenterologist whose name I got from the university hospital in CA where the whole SIBO/Rifaximin Tx originated. Then I went to my new local gastroenterologist and he said Rifaximin didn’t work well and tried me on something else (maybe Augmentin). No help. So treating a bacterial overgrowth didn’t appear to work. I may have had antibiotics at other times for other purposes in between those dates, but don’t remember for sure now.

    Here’s the thing though: I don’t tolerate probiotics well unless I only take them periodically. Loading up on them (or even a “normal” dose of them) results in over-sized difficult to pass stools, extreme abdominal pain, and on one occasion nausea which lead to an episode of vomiting until I finally passed the stool. That is why I kind of like the “Biamonte Method” philosophy of not even considering probiotics until the yeast, etc. is all cleared out. That is, of course, assuming yeast is my problem.

    Renee

    #89076

    ReneeVV
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    Topics: 1
    Replies: 21

    On my 2010 Metametrix GI Function Profile (which is a DNA stool test looking for bacteria, etc.), I had high levels of Bifidobacter. I will go ahead and list my numbers, even though it is difficult to understand what they mean (I’m not entirely sure).

    Predominant Bacteria

    Obligate anaerobes
    Bacteroides 1.8
    Clostridia 3.3
    Prevotella 9.3
    Fusobacteria 5.3
    Streptomyces 2.1
    Mycoplasma 7.0

    Facultative anaerobes
    Lactobacillus 3.7
    Bifidobacter 30.0

    Obligate aerobes
    Esherichia coli 6.4

    Opportunistic Bacteria
    No clinically significant amounts.

    Pathogenic Bacteria
    All 4 kinds listed as tested for (H. pylori, Campylobacter, C. difficile, and E.H.E. coli) are below the detection limit

    Yeast/Fungi
    No clinically significant amounts.

    There were other results for fatty acids, etc. which I haven’t listed.

    #89078

    dvjorge
    Participant
    Topics: 283
    Replies: 1368

    ReneeVV wrote: Yes, I had antibiotics a few times. A couple times it was because I had the SIBO breath test (borderline positive initially), went on Rifaximin (twice), had a follow-up SIBO breath test which was more positive than the first time! That was through a gastroenterologist whose name I got from the university hospital in CA where the whole SIBO/Rifaximin Tx originated. Then I went to my new local gastroenterologist and he said Rifaximin didn’t work well and tried me on something else (maybe Augmentin). No help. So treating a bacterial overgrowth didn’t appear to work. I may have had antibiotics at other times for other purposes in between those dates, but don’t remember for sure now.

    Here’s the thing though: I don’t tolerate probiotics well unless I only take them periodically. Loading up on them (or even a “normal” dose of them) results in over-sized difficult to pass stools, extreme abdominal pain, and on one occasion nausea which lead to an episode of vomiting until I finally passed the stool. That is why I kind of like the “Biamonte Method” philosophy of not even considering probiotics until the yeast, etc. is all cleared out. That is, of course, assuming yeast is my problem.

    Renee

    I see the reason of your very low bacterial profile. It could be smart no to take those antibiotics. Rifaximin and Augmentin are NON-absorbed antibiotics used to kill bacteria inside the intestines. They don’t discriminate between good or bad bacteria.
    I am almost sure you have an intestinal fungal overgrowth because the antibiotics are the #1 cause of this syndrome. I can image the yeast growing like crazy when the antagonistic flora was destroyed.
    You don’t have any other way to begin a battle against the yeast and try to regain part of the lost bacterial flora.

    Jorge.

    #89079

    ReneeVV
    Participant
    Topics: 1
    Replies: 21

    But you would think SOME yeast would have showed up on ONE of the three tests.
    What do you mean “You don’t have any other way to begin a battle against the yeast and try to regain part of the lost bacterial flora”?

    I was sick BEFORE the antibiotics. That’s why they were tried for SIBO – in case that was the source of all of my problems. That said, I’m sure I had antibiotics at different times prior to that.

    Renee

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