Has anybody heard of this NDV-3 vaccine

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This topic contains 106 replies, has 9 voices, and was last updated by  Kag 6 years, 3 months ago.

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  • #98666

    Kag
    Member
    Topics: 18
    Replies: 402

    They put her arm in a cast, that’s good. Sometimes they have to do surgery with breaks. I am glad that she is okay.

    #98872

    Floggi
    Member
    Topics: 1
    Replies: 425


    Ah, so it’s called a cast… Thanks, I just learned a new word!

    Do you mind telling me the name of the material that is traditionally used for the cast? In my language, we’d say “her wrist is in “, so we don’t use a word that’s analogous to ‘cast’.

    #98884

    jameskep
    Participant
    Topics: 25
    Replies: 220

    Floggi,

    I ran into my brother-in-law at a party not to long ago and he was talking about the “Flu Mist” helping him quite a bit more than the flu shot. Just curious on what you have heard with the flu mist vs flu shot? He stated that the flu mist has really helped him during the cold season.

    #98893

    Floggi
    Member
    Topics: 1
    Replies: 425


    Yes, I know about the flu mist. I was going to address it as part of the fourth point which I mentioned earlier (in my list of points to cover): which lines of defence does the body have.

    In short: vaccination activates the body’s last line of defence, which normally is only triggered when the virus has already broken through the earlier lines of defence. So vaccination is unnatural in the sense that normally, the other lines of defence are activated earlier than the last line of defence, but with vaccination, the last line of defence is activated first, without ever activating the earlier lines of defence.

    The earliest line of defence is when the virus is absorbed in the layer of mucus that covers various mucous membranes (nose, mouth, trachea and so on). The body starts attacking the virus, and “pre-activates” the other lines of defence, just in case the virus breaks through this first line.

    The “flu mist” consists of viruses or virus particles that are very similar to the ones that are injected when you are vaccinated. The “mist” is inhaled, absorbed by the mucous layers, and thus activates the first line of defence. It’s much more natural than vaccination.

    Up to now, the problem with this “mist” has always been the dose. It is very, very hard to ensure that the right amount of virus particles is absorbed by the mucous membranes. It must not be too few, because then the first line of defence is not triggered enough, and you are still not protected afterward. It must not be too many either, because then you risk inflammation of the mucous membranes and potentially feeling very, very ill for a week or so.

    This has been an extremely promising idea since at least 1970 or so. We just could not apply it to practice. It’s only very recently that they (“they” being “big evil pharma”) managed to get the dose right, in a reproducible way. And only for a very limited number of viruses.

    It is hoped (and, in fact, expected) that progress in medical treatment/prevention methods will allow us to use the “mist” method for an ever increasing number of diseases in the next 10 to 20 years. Vaccination will probably still be needed for a number of diseases, but much less than today.

    For more information, read the Wikipedia article about LAIV.

    #98898

    Emsmith
    Participant
    Topics: 25
    Replies: 137

    Floggi;37396 wrote:

    The “flu mist” consists of viruses or virus particles that are very similar to the ones that are injected when you are vaccinated. The “mist” is inhaled, absorbed by the mucous layers, and thus activates the first line of defence. It’s much more natural than vaccination.

    Up to now, the problem with this “mist” has always been the dose. It is very, very hard to ensure that the right amount of virus particles is absorbed by the mucous membranes. It must not be too few, because then the first line of defence is not triggered enough, and you are still not protected afterward. It must not be too many either, because then you risk inflammation of the mucous membranes and potentially feeling very, very ill for a week or so.

    Floggi, this is misleading information! The flu mist contains LIVE viruses, the shot contains the same viruses, but they are killed or inactivated.

    The mist is not recommended for anyone with a weakened immune system (probably all of us on the forum), anemia and other blood disorders, asthma, kidney/lung/liver/heart disease, diabetes, children or adolescents on aspirin, seizure disorders, cerebral palsy, etc.

    I don’t know why you’re posting this is more natural than vaccination.
    A. it is a vaccination,
    B. it’s stronger and potentially more harmful than the injection.
    You can catch the flu from the mist if you’re immune system is weakened.

    Also the expected side effects listed on the patient handout include fever, wheezing, abdominal pain, vomiting, diarrhea, cough, headache, muscle aches, congestion, and as with any vaccination, death is also listed as a possibility.

    #98901

    Kag
    Member
    Topics: 18
    Replies: 402

    Hey floggi, the traditional material for a cast is plaster. I don’t know if they always use now, but that is what they used to use.

    #98907

    hope4eva77
    Member
    Topics: 67
    Replies: 548

    http://www.vaccinetruth.org/page_27.htm and http://vran.org/about-vaccines/general-issues/herd-immunity/herd-immunity-the-misplaced-driver-of-universal-vaccination/ and http://www.naturalnews.com/035871_vaccination_immunization_myths.html wow for someone who has mentioned fear many times in their posts its quite funny how u are manipulated by government propaganda !i can pull out tons more pages of how herd immunity is propaganda lies !ment for sheep in a herd ha ha had to say it !

    #98917

    Floggi
    Member
    Topics: 1
    Replies: 425


    Thanks, Katie! You’re my English teacher on this forum! 😉

    Actually, I did come across the word plaster when trying to find the correct English word. However, I was reluctant to use it, because in my language ‘plaster’ is used exclusively for something you put on walls to create a nice-looking surface.

    When I used an online translation program to translate ‘plaster’ back to my language, I got the word ‘pleister’, which is something you put on a small, superficial wound (like a scratch or a cut) as a protection.

    So this picture shows the two meanings that I connected to the word ‘plaster’ – none of these two should be connected to my mother’s wrist…!


    #99049

    Kag
    Member
    Topics: 18
    Replies: 402

    Lol Floggi, I probably could have figured it out. 🙂

    #99160

    jameskep
    Participant
    Topics: 25
    Replies: 220

    Floggi, I like that picture..Pretty funny. That picture reminds me of upper management trying to solve debt issues at work.

    #99259

    Floggi
    Member
    Topics: 1
    Replies: 425

    Version: 1
    Date:     2013-03-03




    About viruses

    What is a virus?

    A virus basically consists of genetic material that resides inside an envelope.

    The genetic material is either DNA or RNA. The envelope consists of proteins, lipids, or both. Some viruses also carry some enzymes inside their envelope. For example, some RNA viruses contain an enzyme (reverse-transcriptase) that converts the virus’ RNA into DNA, after which the DNA takes over command of the infected cell.

    This description is simplified. Much more can be said about viruses, their construction and their workings. The above description suffices for the purposes of this article. Those who like to know more can read the excellent Wikipedia page about viruses.


    What is the difference between viruses and bacteria?

    Bacteria are living cells. They have machinery to metabolise a form of food, they sense and react to their environment, and they replicate.

    Viruses are basically nothing but DNA or RNA in an envelope. They do not live. They don’t digest anything, they don’t sense their environment, they even don’t replicate.

    This is why bacteria can be killed by antibiotics, but viruses cannot. Antibiotics disturb one or more processes that are essential to the bacteria’s survival. Viruses do not exhibit any process at all, so there is nothing to disturb.


    Then how does a virus infect a cell?

    Again, all details are explained on the Wikipedia page about viruses. I will only give a simplified explanation here, as that will suffice for the remainder of this article.

    A virus may infect a cell by an automatic chemical reaction between a protein in its envelope, and a protein on the cell membrane. Depending on the virus, this chemical reaction may result in the fusion of the virus envelope with the cell membrane, which results in the release of the virus’ contents (DNA or RNA, and possibly some enzymes) into the cell. Or the chemical reaction results in a temporary hole in the cell membrane, through which the virus’ contents then quickly enter the cell.


    What happens after infection?

    After infection, the cell’s machinery does what it always does: it transcribes (“copies”) DNA into RNA, and it builds proteins according to the instructions on the RNA.

    After an RNA virus enters the cell, the RNA is translated directly into proteins by the cell’s machinery. If these proteins are RNA-copying proteins, the RNA is also copied many times.

    If the virus is a DNA virus, the DNA is copied to RNA, and the same process as described above takes place.

    If the virus is an RNA virus with the reverse-transcriptase enzyme, the enzyme makes a DNA copy of the virus RNA. Then, the same process occurs as in DNA viruses.

    In all cases, the end result is that the normal machinery of the cell starts executing the instructions that come from the virus RNA/DNA. These instructions tell the cell to create lots and lots of copies of the virus RNA/DNA, and to create lots and lots of the proteins that are in the virus envelope.

    The copies of the virus RNA/DNA and the envelope proteins then self-assemble into new virus particles. Alternatively, some viruses instruct the cell to produce enzymes that take care of the assembly of new virus particles. In both cases, the cell fills up with new virus particles. The new virus particles are either excreted by the cell, or they fill up the cell until the cell bursts and the particles are set free.

    The end result is that the original virus particle that infected the cell no longer exists, but now there are many thousands of identical virus particles.

    The body’s lines of defense

    The first line of defense

    Normally (that is: when we are not wounded), viruses can only enter the body through one of the mucous membranes. Normally, this will be a membrane of the nose, mouth, or throat.

    A virus, being a passive construction, cannot actively swim through the mucus in the direction of a cell. Instead, it just sits in the mucus, waiting until chance brings it in contact with a cell.

    The body contains intrusion-detecting cells and enzymes that are also present in the mucous linings. If these encounter a virus, they will destroy it. This prevents the virus from entering the body at all.


    The second line of defense

    A virus that is not destroyed by the first line of defense may eventually reach one of the cells of the mucous membrane. It has to infect these cells in order to enter the body. The mucus cells are highly resilient to virus infection. If infection does occur, they quickly excrete alarm proteins that alert the body to the infection.

    (Note: I’m not an expert in this field. Therefore, the above description may be overly simplistic, and it may even be a little off. If you have more knowledge about this second line of defense than I have, please share your knowledge, so I can improve this part of the text.)


    The third line of defense

    Once the virus makes it through the layer of cells that line the mucous membrane, it is inside the body. The body now depends on its third line of defense to fight the virus. This third line of defense attacks the virus in two ways.

    The first possibility is that the body attacks the virus itself. This can only be done with virus particles that have not yet infected a cell. These virus particles are recognised by the proteins in their envelope, which are not human proteins. The virus particles are marked by special markers that have two sides: one side chemically binds to the virus protein, the other side signals immune cells to “kill me”. The immune cells then absorb the markers and the viruses to which these markers are attached into little intracellular bags called lysosomes. The cell then fills the lysosome with destructive enzymes. This kills the virus, reducing it to recyclable amino acids and lipides.

    The second possibility is that the body attacks the cells that are already infected by the virus. These cells are doomed anyway, so they may as well be killed immediately. Cells that are infected by a virus mark themselves by embedding specific proteins in their outer membrane. These proteins are recognised by markers in much the same way as the virus proteins are recognised by markers, as described above. The cell is then killed, also killing all viruses inside it.


    #100227

    Floggi
    Member
    Topics: 1
    Replies: 425


    I’ve found time to write a new part of the “virus saga”.

    • New or changed text will appear in red. This allows you to quickly skip the parts you’ve already read and focus on the new or changed parts.
    • I have split the previous text into one posting per “chapter”. I think this makes it easier to read the story.
    • I repeat the entire story. Adding only the parts in red would force you to scroll up and down. Repeating the story allows for easier reading.

    Thus, for an overview, read the entire story below. If you’re only interested in the changes, read only the red parts.

    #100228

    Floggi
    Member
    Topics: 1
    Replies: 425

    Version: 2
    Part:      1 of 3
    Date:     2013-03-10




    About viruses

    What is a virus?

    A virus basically consists of genetic material that resides inside an envelope.

    The genetic material is either DNA or RNA. The envelope consists of proteins, lipids, or both. Some viruses also carry some enzymes inside their envelope. For example, some RNA viruses contain an enzyme (reverse-transcriptase) that converts the virus’ RNA into DNA, after which the DNA takes over command of the infected cell.

    This description is simplified. Much more can be said about viruses, their construction and their workings. The above description suffices for the purposes of this article. Those who like to know more can read the excellent Wikipedia page about viruses.


    What is the difference between viruses and bacteria?

    Bacteria are living cells. They have machinery to metabolise a form of food, they sense and react to their environment, and they replicate.

    Viruses are basically nothing but DNA or RNA in an envelope. They do not live. They don’t digest anything, they don’t sense their environment, they even don’t replicate.

    This is why bacteria can be killed by antibiotics, but viruses cannot. Antibiotics disturb one or more processes that are essential to the bacteria’s survival. Viruses do not exhibit any process at all, so there is nothing to disturb.


    Then how does a virus infect a cell?

    Again, all details are explained on the Wikipedia page about viruses. I will only give a simplified explanation here, as that will suffice for the remainder of this article.

    A virus may infect a cell by an automatic chemical reaction between a protein in its envelope, and a protein on the cell membrane. Depending on the virus, this chemical reaction may result in the fusion of the virus envelope with the cell membrane, which results in the release of the virus’ contents (DNA or RNA, and possibly some enzymes) into the cell. Or the chemical reaction results in a temporary hole in the cell membrane, through which the virus’ contents then quickly enter the cell.


    What happens after infection?

    After infection, the cell’s machinery does what it always does: it transcribes (“copies”) DNA into RNA, and it builds proteins according to the instructions on the RNA.

    After an RNA virus enters the cell, the RNA is translated directly into proteins by the cell’s machinery. If these proteins are RNA-copying proteins, the RNA is also copied many times.

    If the virus is a DNA virus, the DNA is copied to RNA, and the same process as described above takes place.

    If the virus is an RNA virus with the reverse-transcriptase enzyme, the enzyme makes a DNA copy of the virus RNA. Then, the same process occurs as in DNA viruses.

    In all cases, the end result is that the normal machinery of the cell starts executing the instructions that come from the virus RNA/DNA. These instructions tell the cell to create lots and lots of copies of the virus RNA/DNA, and to create lots and lots of the proteins that are in the virus envelope.

    The copies of the virus RNA/DNA and the envelope proteins then self-assemble into new virus particles. Alternatively, some viruses instruct the cell to produce enzymes that take care of the assembly of new virus particles. In both cases, the cell fills up with new virus particles. The new virus particles are either excreted by the cell, or they fill up the cell until the cell bursts and the particles are set free.

    The end result is that the original virus particle that infected the cell no longer exists, but now there are many thousands of identical virus particles.


    #100229

    Floggi
    Member
    Topics: 1
    Replies: 425

    Version: 2
    Part:      2 of 3
    Date:     2013-03-10




    The body’s lines of defense

    The first line of defense

    Normally (that is: when we are not wounded), viruses can only enter the body through one of the mucous membranes. Normally, this will be a membrane of the nose, mouth, or throat.

    A virus, being a passive construction, cannot actively swim through the mucus in the direction of a cell. Instead, it just sits in the mucus, waiting until chance brings it in contact with a cell.

    The body contains intrusion-detecting cells and enzymes that are also present in the mucous linings. If these encounter a virus, they will destroy it. This prevents the virus from entering the body at all.


    The second line of defense

    A virus that is not destroyed by the first line of defense may eventually reach one of the cells of the mucous membrane. It has to infect these cells in order to enter the body. The mucus cells are highly resilient to virus infection. If infection does occur, they quickly excrete alarm proteins that alert the body to the infection.

    (Note: I’m not an expert in this field. Therefore, the above description may be overly simplistic, and it may even be a little off. If you have more knowledge about this second line of defense than I have, please share your knowledge, so I can improve this part of the text.)


    The third line of defense

    Once the virus makes it through the layer of cells that line the mucous membrane, it is inside the body. The body now depends on its third line of defense to fight the virus. This third line of defense attacks the virus in two ways.

    The first possibility is that the body attacks the virus itself. This can only be done with virus particles that have not yet infected a cell. These virus particles are recognised by the proteins in their envelope, which are not human proteins. The virus particles are marked by special markers that have two sides: one side chemically binds to the virus protein, the other side signals immune cells to “kill me”. The immune cells then absorb the markers and the viruses to which these markers are attached into little intracellular bags called lysosomes. The cell then fills the lysosome with destructive enzymes. This kills the virus, reducing it to recyclable amino acids and lipides.

    The second possibility is that the body attacks the cells that are already infected by the virus. These cells are doomed anyway, so they may as well be killed immediately. Cells that are infected by a virus mark themselves by embedding specific proteins in their outer membrane. These proteins are recognised by markers in much the same way as the virus proteins are recognised by markers, as described above. The cell is then killed, also killing all viruses inside it.


    #100230

    Floggi
    Member
    Topics: 1
    Replies: 425

    Version: 2
    Part:      3 of 3
    Date:     2013-03-10




    How viruses spread

    Spreading from human to human

    This section, like the rest of this virus saga, is about viruses that infect humans, and that spread directly from one person to the next. There are other types of viruses that infect plants or even bacteria, but those types are not relevant to this story, so I’ll leave them out.

    The first section explained how a virus spreads from cell to cell. In summary, the virus infects one cell, and it is destroyed in the process. The cell then produces thousands and thousands of copies of the original virus. These copies then leave the cell, and they will infect new cells.

    So far so good, but how does a virus get from one person to another? The answer is: by some way of body excretions.

    This may be through sneezing. Many viruses cause symptoms like sneezing or coughing. This sneezing has a purpose (for the virus): it causes small droplets to be flung into the air. These droplets contain many viruses. If someone else breathes these droplets the viruses have a chance to infect a new person. The droplets may also land on a hand or on a doorknob. Someone else may touch this surface, get the virus particles on his own hand, and when this hand then comes into contact with his nose and mouth (for example, by eating), the virus may infect him.

    Another way for a virus to leave the body is through diarrhea. Some viruses cause extreme diarrhea – the sole purpose of which is to provide a way for the virus to leave the body and thus to have a chance of entering new bodies.

    After entering the new person’s body, the story of the previous section starts anew. Unless, of course, the new person has sufficiently strong lines of defense, as explained in the previous section.


    When will an epidemic start?

    What happens after the first person in a community is infected? Will the others be infected too?

    This depends on the virus, on the circumstances, and on the strength of each person’s immune system.

    • Soms viruses produce lots of “offspring” that leaves the body. Other viruses produce much less “offspring”.
    • Some viruses are very good at penetrating our lines of defense, others are weaker.
    • Once inside the body, some viruses multiply quickly, while others are much slower.
    • Some persons are either immune to this virus, or they are not yet immune but their immune system quickly learns how to fight the new virus. These are the persons (like me) who only have a bit of slime in the throat and the nose, and who feel a bit tired, while others are severely ill for a week.

    Will a virus spread? That depends on the above points. In the end, it’s all a matter of probability. A virus that produces a lot of “offspring” but is weak at penetrating a new person’s lines of defense may have the same chance of spreading as a virus that produces only few “offspring” but that is very good at penetrating the lines of defense.

    If we would have perfect knowledge (we don’t), we could do the calculation like this:

    • An infected person spreads X millions of new virus particles.
    • Each of these virus particles has a chance of A percent to enter a new body.
    • After entering the body, this virus has a B percent chance of penetrating all lines of defense.
    • Having passed all lines of defense, infection is a fact. After infection, the virus has a C percent chance of finding itself in a body that has not yet built immunity against this type of virus, and that is slow enough to build up this immunity, so the virus can multiply first.

    If “X times A times B times C” is high enough, the virus will, on average, infect more than one new person. As long as X, A, B and C remain unchanged within the community, the new person will again, on average, infect more than one person. And so on. The result is that ever more people get ill.

    If, on the other hand, “X times A times B times C” is low enough, the virus will, on average, infect less than one person. Let’s consider an example. 100 persons are ill. They do infect other people, but on average each person infects less than one new person. Let’s say that in the “next round” only 70 persons are infected. Similarly, the third round sees only 49 persons infected. The fourth round has only 34 persons infected, the fifth round only 24, and so on. The disease slowly disappears from the population.


    An example: the common cold

    Let’s take the common winter cold as an example. This virus mutates quickly, so each winter we are confronted with a new strain to which we have no immunity.

    • During winter, our behaviour changes. We stay closer together in heated rooms. This increases A, the chance that the virus can move from one person to the next.
    • When outside in the cold, the mucous layer is thinner. This makes it easier for the virus to penetrate this layer. In other words, B is increased.
    • The same low temperatures cause less blood to flow to our mucus membranes, carrying less immune cells to those membranes. This, too, increases B.
    • At the start of the cold season, are immune systems aren’t trained yet to this strain of virus. Thus, C is high.

    The result is that many people suffer from the common cold.

    When the cold season ends, the opposite occurs. A, B and C all decrease. The virus will infect, on average, less than one new person. The infection with the common cold disappears from the population. Every now and then someone still catches a cold, but this will not spread to others.


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