Chelators and one theory.!

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This topic contains 6 replies, has 4 voices, and was last updated by  Cheesey 5 years, 8 months ago.

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  • #109581

    dvjorge
    Participant
    Topics: 283
    Replies: 1368

    Hi all,

    I am going to expeculate about something.

    Candida Related Complex, the syndrome most of us are battling, is an Iatrogenic condition caused by the disruption of LAB in our intestines. LAB protect us against candida albicans germination. Candida albicans single cells can live perfectly where LAB are present ,but they can not germinate when the bacteria are present.

    What do happen when we take antibiotics repeatedly or a long treatment using broad spectrum antibiotics ??

    LAB are reduced or eliminated causing candida albicans single cells begin to germinate. When the germination occurs, and this is the critical part, candida albicans cell wall breaks releasing fragments that are absorbed by the intestinal lining and go to our bloodstream. One of this fragment is MANNAN, a carbohydrate present in the yeast cell wall. When mannan gets the blood, it is seen as an antigen and wakes up an immune response. It means it stimulates the immune system. However, mannan in the blood binds with copper, a mineral present in our blood creating a complex called mannan/copper complex. According to the research, this mix is what has a severe immune suppression power, suppressing our cell-mediated immunity (Th1).

    Cell-mediated immunity is our innate defense against superficial mucosal candidiasis. Then, when candida albicans morphogenesis occurs inside our gut, there is a simultaneous event setting the infection and suppressing our Th1 immune response.

    The chelators.

    Most of you know I have been reading for some years candida patients forums, and I am aware about what people report.
    Chelation and mercury is a common topic for candida sufferers since some people have reported cured after following chelation therapies with DMSA, DMPS,and EDTA.

    Why I am not mentioning ALA that is considered by Andy Cutler the most efficient mercury chelator ??

    Because I don’t know about anybody reporting a cure taking ALA alone to chelate mercury. On the other hand, I have read about some people trying to chelate mercury with ALA alone to overcome CRC that never see progress. ALA don’t chelate Iron and Copper but DMSA,EDTA, and DMPS do.

    My hypothesis.

    Since all the cured reports I am aware of come from people who took DMPS, DMSA, or EDTA, I am expeculating the benefits of these chelators aren’t because they are removing mercury but cooper and iron and detoxing the blood of the mannan/copper complex. Iron is vital for candida and cooper is what binds with mannan to create the immune suppressor complex. I have read in medical papers that mannan catabolization is slow, so I am thinking that a chelator such as DMSA, DMPS,or EDTA is helping or accelerating mannan/cooper complex elimination from the blood, even more when I have read that people who get IV DMPS get better faster and can eliminate chronic candida infections. I guess, these people get cell mediated immunity restoration and eliminate candida infections.

    You all know that without an immune response, there isn’t way we can cure an infection. I think a simultaneous anticandida treatment plus the use of a chelator agent is what has taken many sufferers to a final cure.

    Jorge.

    #109629

    Able900
    Spectator
    Topics: 92
    Replies: 4811

    Chelation and mercury is a common topic for candida sufferers since some people have reported cured after following chelation therapies with DMSA, DMPS,and EDTA.

    Hello, Jorge.

    Thanks for the additional information in your always-informative posts concerning chelation.

    I have read about biochemical biopsy or Provocative Challenge assessments conducted by some physicians and labs to detect different metals in their patients’ urine. It’s explained that each of the three chelating agents (DMSA, DMPS, and EDTA) are used separately, and the labs use EDTA only to test for lead because, as the results were explained, when EDTA is used alone, without fail the only “metal spill” in the urine is lead. I’m wondering, in all of your research on chelation therapy, have you ever read or heard of a study leading to the possibility of EDTA being used to somehow remove a metal other than lead from the body? If so, I would be interested in reading this research since I’ve been unable to find the information myself.
    Also have you come across research concerning the possibility of lead toxicity playing a role in the overgrowth of Candida?

    Thanks, Able

    #109633

    dvjorge
    Participant
    Topics: 283
    Replies: 1368

    Able900;48150 wrote:

    Chelation and mercury is a common topic for candida sufferers since some people have reported cured after following chelation therapies with DMSA, DMPS,and EDTA.

    Hello, Jorge.

    Thanks for the additional information in your always-informative posts concerning chelation.

    I have read about biochemical biopsy or Provocative Challenge assessments conducted by some physicians and labs to detect different metals in their patients’ urine. It’s explained that each of the three chelating agents (DMSA, DMPS, and EDTA) are used separately, and the labs use EDTA only to test for lead because, as the results were explained, when EDTA is used alone, without fail the only “metal spill” in the urine is lead. I’m wondering, in all of your research on chelation therapy, have you ever read or heard of a study leading to the possibility of EDTA being used to somehow remove a metal other than lead from the body? If so, I would be interested in reading this research since I’ve been unable to find the information myself.
    Also have you come across research concerning the possibility of lead toxicity playing a role in the overgrowth of Candida?

    Thanks, Able

    EDTA is the former older chelator agent. It was used to chelate heavy metal toxicity in general, including mercury even when it is poor doing this job.

    As you know, the link between heavy metals and chronic candidiasis is totally anecdotal. Lead may cause a drop in cell-mediated immunity allowing candida infections. I haven’t information about it.

    I have read some cases of people reporting a “cure” after chelating with DMPS or DMSA that also remove lead.

    It could be possible that lead be the cause in some cases.

    Jorge.

    #109634

    dvjorge
    Participant
    Topics: 283
    Replies: 1368

    [h][/h]Here is the reality, whatever thing this chelator agents are doing, they are helping to rescue Th1 and this what allows a definitive cure for chronic mucosal candidiasis.

    Effects of environmental lead exposure on T-helper cell-specific cytokines in children.
    Hsiao CL, Wu KH, Wan KS.
    Source
    Department of Pediatrics, Taipei City Hospital, Yang Ming Branch, Taiwan.
    Abstract
    [h][/h]Lead (Pb) may alter T-lymphocyte reactivity in situ by preferentially enhancing the development of T-helper 2 (T(H)2)- and inhibiting T(H)1-lymphocyte development. These effects could result in dysregulation of the presence/availability of T(H)1- and T(H)2-associated cytokines[h][/h]. The aim of this study was two-fold, that is, to assess whole blood Pb levels in schoolchildren from Taiwanese communities that varied in degree of potential for Pb exposure and then ascertain if there were relationships between Pb exposure and changes in levels of key T(H)1 and T(H)2 cytokines. Grades 5 and 6 students were selected from four different community schools, i.e., one from: urban area with new homes; urban area with old homes; rural site with old homes; and area located near an oil refinery. Students at each site were further divided into healthy and respiratory allergy subgroups. Blood was collected and whole blood Pb levels and serum interferon (IFN)-γ, interleukin (IL)-12, -4, and -5 levels were determined. The results indicate no differences in whole blood Pb levels (<4 µg/dl) among students from urban and rural sites; these values were similar in the healthy and allergic subjects. Serum T(H)1 and T(H)2 cytokine levels also did not differ among/within the groups. In contrast, refinery children had significantly increased Pb levels (5.2-8.8 µg/dl) relative to any of the other sets' levels. Of these, children with allergies had serum T(H)2 cytokine levels significantly higher and T(H)1 cytokine levels significantly lower than their healthy counterparts. Oddly, though having elevated Pb levels, healthy refinery students did not display altered T(H)1 or T(H)2 cytokine levels relative to control student values. From this, we conclude that substantively increased whole blood Pb levels may promote T(H) cell dysregulation and alter the availability of key T(H)1 and T(H)2 cytokines, effects that could ultimately contribute to development of pulmonary allergic diseases.[h][/h]

    #109635

    Cheesey
    Member
    Topics: 37
    Replies: 245

    It is interesting that this theory echoes the work of Dr Lawrence Wilson, who claims that copper is a primary antagonist in prolonged non-specific illness. Unlike your post, however, he suggests that a copper balance can be restored and heavy metals detoxified via careful nutritional balancing. Moreover, Dr Wilson actively rejects the use of chelators as they chelate essential minerals as well and can lead to a further nutritional imbalance.

    http://www.drlwilson.com/articles/copper_toxicity_syndrome.htm

    Considering this information, and the experience of Dr Wilson in using nutritional balancing to treat metal toxicity, would you suggest that chelation therapy is the only means to rid the body of heavy metal toxicity? If so, why?

    #109640

    raster
    Participant
    Topics: 104
    Replies: 6838

    There are other ways to chelate the heavy metals. Dr. Mcoombs mentioned how probiotics can help reduce mercury levels within the body. Hope this helps cheesey.

    -raster

    #109668

    Cheesey
    Member
    Topics: 37
    Replies: 245

    Thanks Raster. I was just wondering what Jorge’s opinion was as a great number of people assert that chelators are the only means to get rid of metal toxicity. One person on Curezone suggested that the only way to get rid of mercury toxicity was chelation or death. I’m thinking this is a little extreme.

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