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eskimo_pup;28418 wrote: with the oil i presumed the only difference was organic i didn’t consider it’s processed differently. Some of the oil on the websites you guys have recommended are very very cheap- presumably because they are own brand. If both of these are reliable and trustworthy products i will purchase the cheapest unless again their is some benefit to the other one:

The probiotics are still sealed so i will be returning them to h+b and the biokult ones i haven’t purchased yet, they both contain maltodextrin.

So then i need recommendations, budget but gets the job done. Bear in mind i’ve got this other treatment giving me die-off and i have cfs so i don’t want to charge at the infection like a bull in a china shop.

I can’t get any more cheap milk thistle tincture in the h+b sales as it’s discontinued, are tablets ok? I will also be avoiding h+b if possible now i have alternatives, truth is i didn’t know where else to go.

Is it ok to have both probiotics and kefir or will it overload my system?

How have you found the perrin technique? I’d be interested if it’s working, I’ve never heard of it before.

I would say it’s definitely not a quick fix, it is expensive, long term [roughly 2/3 years] and painful but yes I’ve seen good results on it.

Dr. Perrin who is actually an osteopath but was rewarded an honorary degree for his research into CFS/M.E. put the system together when he realized some of his patients were having unintended positive reactions towards their CFS symptoms as a result of his standard osteopathic sessions.

He then went on a crusade to get to the bottom of it and that is what earned him is honorary degree and led to the Perrin Technique.

“….Dr Perrin’s theory that different stress factors whether physical, allergies, emotional or infections lead to an overstrain of the sympathetic nervous system.

Further investigation has led to a probable cause of this nervous system overload being a build up of toxins in the fluid around the brain and the spinal cord.

The toxins are also meant to drain down the spinal cord and out into the lymph ducts lying along the spine. In a CFS/ME sufferer these normal drainage points are congested…”

“…The sympathetic nerves also have been found to control a pump mechanism within the main drainage of the lymphatic system which becomes disturbed in CFS/ME. The resultant backflow further engorges the lymphatic vessels, especially in the chest and neck.”

You can buy the book from Amazon which details the technique. Essentially it’s lymphatic massage and some exercises. The lymphatic system is one of the bodies methods to clear toxins but it has no pump as such like the heart, it relies on physical activity to move the toxins through and people with CFS get very little of that.

Bear in mind i’m a layman so there’s a lot more to it then that. Anyway as a result of lymphatic massage all the toxins that have built up in the body over time go into the bloodstream causing die-off.

You are always cautioned you will feel worse before feeling better! Die-off reactions as you can imagine vary anywhere from mild to very severe.

Dr. Perrin has many detractors that call him a fraud but it is worth noting there have been research trials with universities and i believe more recently with the NHS.

I think in trials the success rate was between 40 to 55 % but don’t quote me on that.

All research papers and info is on his website and i believe a six part lecture is on youtube.

Got any specific questions aimed at me feel free! D:

Just to chip in about the Perrin technique – I’ve found it really very helpful in removing toxin building-up. I’ve been visiting a practitioner (at first once every week, then every fortnight) and doing my own exercises (5 minutes of massaging at night and head drainage exercises 3 x per day) for 5 months, and I’ve now got the energy to walk my dog, etc.

Eskimo_pup: I don’t know why you’re finding it painful; it isn’t supposed to be. Do you mean that the massaging reveals your lymphatic system to be blocked and sore? Of course, this is exactly what is the root of the toxicity problem; but the soreness diminishes after a while.

So, in sum: I’ve found it very helpful for my CFS, and at the point when I’m beginning to increase my toxic load through die-off, indispensable!